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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2001, 09:18 PM
KentBrockman KentBrockman is offline
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 724
Default article - Asian lines

This article is "stolen" from bettingadvice, but I liked it very much:

The intricates of Asian Handicap betting by Nero, 05.01.01

I thought workings in Wall Street were intricate until I went deeper into the workings of the bookies. It always makes me wonder about the intricacies involved when they invented ‘Mahjong’ in days before the calculator was thought of (oh, they had the abacus). The mahjong played to-day is the simplified version (originated in Taiwan) and very few know how to play the original style with calculations of points even when you don’t mahjong (game) that hand!

Hey, we’re talking about the Chinese! They’re tops when it comes to calculating odds and they even practise this in their daily legitimate business transactions!

The way they manipulate the market makes them the ‘risk underwriters’ and ‘commission brokers’ all at the same time! Not forgetting that they have countless of ‘Agents’ and their ‘sales force’ in each location makes the top local life insurance company’s agency there look like a troop of boy scouts!

The bookies’ network spans to almost every city in the East and with the blossoming economy in the region, their kitty gets larger and they are beginning to exert their influence in Europe!

Their headquarters are in cities where the authorities are ‘lenient’ , like Bangkok, Jakarta and Kuala Lumpur. Here in Singapore, the authorities have enacted a case law this week (this definitely interests you) that, ‘no person or corporate body can bring a claim against anyone or corporate if it is proven or made obvious that the debt derives from gambling' !!

Frankly, I’d think twice about offering gambling facilities to holders of credit cards issued by any bank in Singapore. The cases in question arose from two claims made by casinos in Las Vegas and Perth (Australia).

Anyway that’s not what I intend to relate to you. I thought perhaps you’d be interested in reading how the illegal bookies in this part of the world make their money.

by Nero, 05.01.01

Ever wondered why? More so, why do fools rush into where angels fear to tread? - It is that instinctive urge to wager a bet. Call the specific aim as greed, satisfy an addiction or whatever you like, there will be no end to gambling, in fact it expands and improves with sophistication well supported by modern technology! Bettors are risk-takers and bookies are risk underwriters. Wait a minute, is this generalised statement true? We’ll find out soon enough when you read on!


1. Man-U hosts Arsenal and the Bookies quoted Man-U offering ½ goal handicap.

2. The bets on Man-U come pouring in! A major change is needed! So the odds change to ¾ goal. Overwhelming support is still coming in so it moves up to 1 and suddenly the trend reversed with more bets coming in support for Arsenal than for Man-U! Do they back-track? No! Because it’ll be back to the previous square!

3. So what's the remedy? They’ll still hang on to the 1 goal but with a discount on the winnings of the acceptor e.g., say 90% of the stake. This discount ranges between 77.5% to 97.5 % of the stake money. Any adjustment needed below or above the minimum or maximum discounts respectively will result in a ‘major change’ i.e., the goal odds!

4. This money discount is applicable to counter-offers too! If the Bookies offer 1 goal and a 90% discount on the acceptors winnings and a bettor would like to offer the same terms, there is an automatic 7.5% surcharge on the winnings. This is on top of any discounts quoted in respect of minor changes in the odds as indicated above, e.g., taking the scenario in 2.3 above:-

4.1 Bookies offer 1 goal to Arsenal losing only 90% of the bet.

4.2 Bettor would like to offer the same terms.

4.3 Fine! The Bookies accept the bet and levy a 7.5% commission charge.

4.4 Bettor stands to lose 97.5% and not the 90% which the Bookie would lose had the bettor accepted the bet!

5. The above is only in a case where the Bookies quoted the odds with a discount in their loss. Sometimes there will be a discount in their winnings too e.g., in the 2.3 scenario, the discount has hit 77.5% and the support for Man-U at 1 is still coming in! The Bookies now quote 1¼ goal and as a ‘carrot’ for acceptors, they take a discount on their winnings, say 85%. So an acceptor of that 1¼ goal handicap loses only 85% of the bet. Likewise if a bettor would like to offer the same terms as the Bookies, his loss will not be 85 % but 92.5% (7.5% for the surcharge)! Neat and easy!

I don’t blame anyone in the West who needed more time to get accustomed to this system of betting and handicapping. Even our horse-racing odds are different. The eventual pay-out amount is not at the time of bet was placed but at the time the totalisator closed. So a punter placing a bet at 4-1 may be paid 5-4 or even 12-1! Not really what you calculated for! So there’s always a mad scramble to place a bet at the very last minute, applies to football too! The final analysis is ‘it could be better or for worse’

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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 01-06-2001, 06:13 AM
Shawn Shawn is offline
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,782

I hadn't seen this latest permutation of the Asian system until recently, the "lose 90%" thing. In a sense it's just too complicated and makes a mountain out of a molehill. Instead of "lose 90%" one would think they could just pay people at 2.125.

I could be mistaken but the "lose 90%" is only in certain markets, and is not all over the place.

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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 01-13-2001, 06:47 PM
boris boris is offline
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 445

The lose 90 is in all the genuine Asian markets.

The article copied above is full of basic mathematical errors... Don't believe a word of it.
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 01-14-2001, 05:54 AM
Shawn Shawn is offline
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,782


No, I know the article has to be mathematically incorrect...

but I didn't know the "lose 90" was so widespread. i understand it, I just don't like it. I'm surprised customers put up with it...but then again if you take the time to learn basic Hang Cheng, what's one more wrinkle? maybe it's just my own taste but I'd rather see 2.10 or 2.125 or whatever instead of lose-90.

PS--Hope this note finds you in better spirits.
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