Unauthorized Transfer from my Neteller Account!

[kauphy]

yes someone got on my account and used someones c-card caz i do not have a c-card so it was,nt mine and when i told them they said nothing about it just about the money that they said i owed. and yes i did charge-back the money that they tryed to take but caz it was the instant thing they had already gotten the 505$ from my account and now netellers lawyer said i owe them that it was my furlt that i give them my log-in details which i did not nobody had them but me. you know i don,t even think that they look into this like they said caz i know they could have found out who the c-card belonged to and the money was sent over seas which i,m sure they could have found out where it went seeing i live in the states. kathy

[BetMore]

Got an answer from the Neteller investigations. What a crock of $hit. If they want to treat me like I am a dumb phukk who does not know jack about the widespread 10bet scam, they are asking for trouble.

I will take a day to cool off.

What do you guys suggest I do next?

=================

Dear BetMore,

The NETELLER Investigations department has been informed of unauthorized transactions in your personal account. A file was opened regarding this matter and it was concluded that the transactions and logins to your NETELLER account most likely were a result of a virus on your personal PC and/ or a breach of security on your personal email account and/or a reply to a phishing scam.

Ultimately, NETELLER clients are responsible for the security on any system used to login as well as the confidentiality of their account details. This condition can also be found outlined in our Terms of Use on the main NETELLER website (www.NETELLER.com). NETELLER will be holding you liable for all transactions within the account.

I've sent the inquiries to the merchant sites that received the funds from your NETELLER account. However, I am still waiting for their response.


Listed below are all transaction codes for the disputed transfers. You may contact your merchant with these codes in order to retrieve pertinent information and/ or any funds available for return. If you don't have this merchant's contact information, please try to google its name and see if there's any email address or phone number on their site.

[…]

Please note their response can be forwarded to the NETELLER Investigations department for further review.

You are also free to continue to investigate the disputed transactions so that you may seek recovery from any wrongdoer by notifying relevant law enforcement agencies. NETeller will co-operate in such an investigation.

Inquiries from law enforcement agencies should be sent to our Investigations Department at:

NETeller Investigations
Fax: 1-403-769-3435, Attn: Investigations
E-Mail: Investigations@NETeller.com

Regards,

[Minnow]

Total bullshit. They know damn well the reason this is happening, and they are the only ones who can stop it, but they choose to pretend it's your fault. Now that I am aware of the scam it pisses me off thinking back on the night the cs guy was helping me void my pending eft.. He acted impatient and like.. "what now?!" when I mentioned the 10bets debit attempt.. I'm sure now he knew damn well.

[he scores]

Did everyone that get a 10bet withdrawal attempt also download poker software at one time or another? That seems to be the common thread here. I've never downloaded or used any poker software, since I don't play poker. Is that the one commond thread?

[he scores]

Originally Posted by BetMore

What do you guys suggest I do next?

That's pretty tough BetMore. I was hoping you would get some help from Neteller. If you're an international customer then withdraw all your funds from Neteller and close your account. AFTER you have nothing left in your Neteller account, then call, e-mail, or live chat Neteller to tell them that their customer service sucks **** and that you will never use them again.

How much did you lose?

[JeffP]

Been doing a ton of research lately on Neteller. Found something a programmer posted about a security design flaw in Neteller's Merchant API on a software development forum back in Dec 2004.

Here's the link:
<?php echo 'R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah'; ?>: December 2004

Scroll down. (3rd post from the top)

Saturday, December 11, 2004
NETELLER - Privacy and security design flaw

Yesterday, colleague of mine brought to my notice about a payment system called NETELLER and it's merchant API named NETELLER Direct API V4.

This NETELLER Direct API V4, helps the merchant to collect amount from users. It's simple--same just like early Authorize.net, along with the required amount you collect the user's id and password and post them to their API URL and they'll send you back with success or error codes in XML format.

The major problem with these types of system is security and privacy--you lose both as you're forced to type your username and password in alien web page. If I remember right, this is was the case with Authorize.net and they changed their design to something like PayPal. The PayPal design is somewhat better as you never type or forced to type your username and password in other alien web pages.

The alien merchant web page uses NETELLER Direct API V4 is forced to get user's NETELLER account and password. I'm much sure that the alien website will obviously store such info--but what if they tried to access user's NETELLER account?

The funniest part of this NETELLER design is that they call it more secure and in their security page they advice "Never share your NETELLER Password or Secure ID with anyone. You will never be asked to disclose your password or Secure ID by a NETELLER representative or anyone affiliated with NETELLER."

Beware of NETTELLER!--until they fix their design flaw.

posted by R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah @ 7:38 PM 12/11/2004

Don't know if this will help anyone out or not in dealing with Neteller. How they can tell you it's your fault is ridiculous. In plain English, the design flaw is this:

When you use the merchant's own web page you key in your account number and secure id. The merchant web page has the ability to (and probably does) write both your account number and secure id to a database. Anybody with a copy of that databse has that merchant's entire transaction history including account number, amount, and secure id for every Neteller transaction. To get money out of a customer account, all anyone needs is access to the Merchant API, a valid account number and a secure id.

If you ask me I'd bet a merchant database somewhere has been compromised.

Truly sad that Neteller's Merchant API is so weak from a security standpoint. Even sadder that they won't step up and do the right thing. By saying it's your fault they are basically saying its ok for a merchant to do whatever they want with your account. Imagine if your own bank acted that way!

If you haven't done so already call Neteller immediately and have them issue you a new secure id. And make all outgoing transfers to merchants on your customer interface from now on. Not on a merchant's web page.



-jp

.

[marc]

Originally Posted by kauphy

yes someone got on my account and used someones c-card caz i do not have a c-card so it was,nt mine and when i told them they said nothing about it just about the money that they said i owed. and yes i did charge-back the money that they tryed to take but caz it was the instant thing they had already gotten the 505$ from my account and now netellers lawyer said i owe them that it was my furlt that i give them my log-in details which i did not nobody had them but me. you know i don,t even think that they look into this like they said caz i know they could have found out who the c-card belonged to and the money was sent over seas which i,m sure they could have found out where it went seeing i live in the states. kathy

Did the lawyer leave his name and number. My attorneys have been having a tough time getting ahold of netellers attorneys. If anyone should be afraid of a lawsuit, it is neteller

[Minnow]

Jeff, Welcome to Majorwager.. good find there. I mentioned posting once, wondering if anyone thought it might be risky entering info on a merchants cashier page, and I don't remember anyone addressing the possibility of a security breach due to flawed software. I'm surprised that any merchant would store secure info on site, considering how often the infamous "disgruntled ex-employee" has wreaked havok in other situations.

[indio]

don't know how relevent this link is and it certainly isn't going to help anyone but i think you'll find this link interesting. please note the date of this Dept. of Justice press release. I know some people who read my posts are coming to the conclusion that i'm delusional but i really feel that operatives in the justice department might be facillitating the fraud issues , either with some inside assistance or one of their computer whizzes ( either employee or some felon they arrested). Why, you might ask.......well, it's their objective to destroy the credibility of all offshore payment proccessors. This is war and the intelligence community in the US knows all the tricks in the book. If they cause a panic in the offshore world, they figure many places will wither and die. I'm not saying this is the case here, heck i'll even admit that it's unlikely but believe me, it should be considered.

U.S. Arrests Queens Man on Computer Fraud Charges (December 20, 2002)


Neteller is mentioned in the 4rth and 5th paragraph

[Total Square]

Originally Posted by indio

don't know how relevent this link is and it certainly isn't going to help anyone but i think you'll find this link interesting. please note the date of this Dept. of Justice press release. I know some people who read my posts are coming to the conclusion that i'm delusional but i really feel that operatives in the justice department might be facillitating the fraud issues , either with some inside assistance or one of their computer whizzes ( either employee or some felon they arrested). Why, you might ask.......well, it's their objective to destroy the credibility of all offshore payment proccessors. This is war and the intelligence community in the US knows all the tricks in the book. If they cause a panic in the offshore world, they figure many places will wither and die. I'm not saying this is the case here, heck i'll even admit that it's unlikely but believe me, it should be considered.

U.S. Arrests Queens Man on Computer Fraud Charges (December 20, 2002)


Neteller is mentioned in the 4rth and 5th paragraph

old story that had quite a thread back when it occurred.

[kauphy]

Originally Posted by marc

Did the lawyer leave his name and number. My attorneys have been having a tough time getting ahold of netellers attorneys. If anyone should be afraid of a lawsuit, it is neteller

yes i think i have it not sure will look for it and if i find it will give it to you kauphy

[BetMore]

Neteller response:

Dear BetMore,

I've received the merchant's reply. The funds has been transferred to an account under Mr. Olen Max at Mansion's site. This account was registered with an address in London. Unfortunately, the funds have been lost to random people at Mansion's site. I am sorry for the loss. You are free to continue to investigate the disputed transactions so that you may seek recovery from any wrongdoer by notifying relevant law enforcement agencies. NETeller will co-operate in such an investigation.


WHAT A CROCK OF $HIT.

[clevfan]

Wow!

[DrunkenGoon]

Yeah, when I called them yesterday they told him they had closed my investigation on the 14. They didn't even bother to let me know about it.

I asked them if there is a way to limit the merchants my account can transfer funds to. They said no.

They did reopen my account and changed my secure id. When I logged in, I found 3 more transactions in the account(all declined due to the lack of funds) on the 29th of January(day of the original transactions). The funny thing is these transactions were done 2 hours AFTER they closed the account for "investigation".

The guy I was talking to also said they have no way of catching quick repeat hits on the same account as different player have different loading patterns.

They pretty much said you're shit outta luck and the scary part is that they cannot guarantee that this will not happen again.

I told them about the API issue and he sounded like he didn't know what that means, put me on hold for 15 minutes then came back to tell me the person that might be able to look into that is not there.

What a clusterfukk neteller security is.

[SlipperyPete]

Someone hacks their system and they dont give a fuck???????

This whole things reeks of an inside job.

[StarnetGypsy]

Originally Posted by SlipperyPete

This whole things reeks of an inside job.

Oh, def Pete!

Had my account for 2/yrs w/o any probs at all ... what I'm reading here is insane.

[Slash]

Goon, aren't you based in Europe? If yes, how can this happen??? I thought your NETeller account was automatically locked if you use the account away from your home country...

[DrunkenGoon]

I'm based in Canada.

The problem is that this was not done by logging into my neteller account. That is the only thing they monitor. The transactions where done from the client's (Pay-Pro) interface. So far I have yet to hear back from the poker site which is a completely different issue than neteller.

Either way, this is a screw the player situation, lesson learned, everybody else be advised.

I'll probably just stick with the asians and tell neteller and the rest of these sites to go fukk themselves. It's hard enough winning, let alone when you have to overcomes clusterfukks like this.

[stevo]

Originally Posted by DrunkenGoon

I'm based in Canada.

The problem is that this was not done by logging into my neteller account. That is the only thing they monitor. The transactions where done from the client's (Pay-Pro) interface. So far I have yet to hear back from the poker site which is a completely different issue than neteller.

Either way, this is a screw the player situation, lesson learned, everybody else be advised.

I'll probably just stick with the asians and tell neteller and the rest of these sites to go fukk themselves. It's hard enough winning, let alone when you have to overcomes clusterfukks like this.

Everyone remeber when Netteller was respected? Things change fast. I'm sorry this happened to you Goon and other guys.

No respect for Netteller. Not that they care anyways.